NYC taxi drives launch second GPS-related strike
Right on cue, the New York Taxi Workers Alliance has now launched into its second strike in as many months, with its concerns over GPS units in its drivers' cabs still unresolved. According to the AP, Taxi Workers Alliance executive director Bhairavi Desai says that 75% of all of its drivers (representing a fifth of the city's total drivers) were on strike, although it's apparently not entirely clear how many drivers are actually honoring the strike. As before, the main point of contention is the GPS units that drivers are being required to used, which the cabbies say represent an invasion of privacy and work "erratically at best." From the looks of it, there's no indication as to how long this latest strike might last, although the last one ran for 48 hours.
Filed under: Gaming, Transportation
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
getz76 @ Oct 22nd 2007 12:30PM
These morons are putting pressure on the TLC how? Do you think the TLC really cares? Do you think the average person using cabs will have sympathy for this? I know I don't. This is all over GPS and credit cards. Morons.
Xzavier @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:58PM
Well I don't know if the TLC cares and obviously you don't care, however it does apparently seem to be that the Taxi drivers care, hence the reason of the STRIKE! Maybe we need some more people caring here in the States instead of saying I don’t give a sh!t?
It is good to see that their are still a few people that will take a stand for THEIR rights! You go Taxi Drivers, because nobody else will do it for you!
"U.S. District Judge Richard M. Berman refused to block the rule from taking effect, saying the use of the technology to improve taxi service appeared to outweigh drivers' privacy rights. He urged the two sides to negotiate and set the next hearing for Oct. 10."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21034113/
They are negotiating… The judge and perhaps a few others just don’t like what they are negotiating about. What else should the discussion be about, the size of the LCD screen?
I wonder how many people are going to start complaining about Mayor Bloomberg’s new commuter Congestion Pricing/taxation or the NY MTA with their upcoming outrageous fare hike proposal? Yea yea yea I know. Just shut up and go along with the program. Let the city/state/government/corporation/whomever impose whatever they want to impose upon you. Just pay your taxes and keep your mouth shut! The only right you have is the right to pay your taxes “ON TIME” and legalized extortion! That is one way how the rich get richer and the poor get poorer!
It must be the cabbies fault from swindling the customer out of million/billions of dollars! We need those GPS in their cabs to monitor their activities and make sure they are being fair to their customers. Meanwhile look at what the city does and nobody peeps a word! Pathetic!
Yea… go ahead and flame me… but it’s true!
Jesse S @ Oct 22nd 2007 12:32PM
I was in a Taxi with the GPS, and it sucks. All it is is ads, and a ticker for NBC news. You can extend the map to block the ads. But the map doesn't have a way for anyone to input directions, so you really cannot have an idea if you are getting ripped off or not.
It sucks, and it should not be manditory. It is too expensive, for no benefit to anyway.
Mike @ Oct 22nd 2007 12:44PM
Isn't the real benefit to the customer the ability to pay with credit cards? Every cab I've been in in Europe has this, it makes life so much easier to not have to worry if you have enough money to get back to the hotel in an unknown city. As for the GPS and ads... everything has ads plastered all over it now anyway, I'm waiting for the ads to start scrolling in my own car.
Anytime you turn a cash business in to an electronic business (tracked) you're going to upset the people who exploit the system (under report to the IRS).
The otherside is that NY Cabbies just don't like to be told what to do. There are lots of places were cabbies are polite and actually want your business, as opposed to considering you an unfortunate byproduct of their business.
j.R @ Oct 22nd 2007 12:58PM
@Mike
DC: Cabbies threaten to strike because they have to start using meters as opposed to the unfair and antiquated zone system
Philadelphia: Cabbies pretend that their credit card system is broken, deny you service if they dont think it's worth their while, or my personal favorite, drop you off at Wawa to get cash from the ATM and wait outside with the meter running
Boston: ... well I just assumed everyone there is a douchebag
Good luck trying to find those nice cabbies in the NEast
Jesse S @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:14PM
Mike, in every cab I've been in for at least the past 10 years, there has been a credit card reader.
And if the GPA goes down, so does the meter, and the credit card reader.
This has no benefit to the consumer or driver. Waste of time and money.
Also: http://tinyurl.com/2wsurn
Christopher Grant @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:40PM
j.R:
That's happened to me in Philly. I just refused to pay him and told him to call the cops. The Philadelphia Parking Authority requires that all customers be given access to that payment option. Refusal is not allowed.
http://www.philapark.org/taxi_limo/taxi_limo_regulations.aspx
James @ Oct 22nd 2007 3:20PM
Everybody read Jesse's link (from tinyurl) -- it goes to an NYT article by a NY cabbie about what a bad idea these things are.
In short. They're really expensive, and they do nothing to benefit the consumer that they don't already get. It's an *unfunded mandate*, the worst sort of regulation. Pretty much any NY cab already takes credit cards, and the *market* lets them decide what merchant service provider to go through. This would lock everybody into the same provider, and force them to whether they want to or not. It doesn't give directions, and if an individual cab line wants to track their drivers, they could make that part of the contract to use any system they (the company) chose, and there are several "fleet trackers" on the market. This is one-size-fits all fiat, and the primary beneficiary is neither the customer nor the cabbie nor the cab company, but the people that make this bloated POS console.
At least, that's what I've seen every time I go looking for any sort of detail on the subject.
jroc @ Oct 22nd 2007 12:42PM
It is an invasion of privacy. And these methods of control and survalliance are stupid, rfid..gps..cameras in london. I just wish big government would leave everyone alone.
benji jasik @ Oct 22nd 2007 12:47PM
this is stupid. I already have gps in my cell, and ususally enable it when in cabs (telenav or google maps). They can fight this, but can't fight that we'll all have networked devices with GPS in them soon, which can send info to any web service we choose. They should get on top of things and enable these devices and provide me a better user experience. Otherwise, it's going to come to them from a third-party.
Jesse S @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:20PM
This has NOTHING to do with them ripping you off. They are the ones getting ripped off. This has to do with them paying thousands that they shouldn't have to, and them being able to be tracked by the TLC, regardless if they own their cab or not.
mason @ Oct 22nd 2007 12:53PM
I mean, I disagree with the main contention the taxi drivers have; I say buck up, join the 20th century so consumers can pay with a credit card, and stop pretending that this is a privacy issue. It's more of an issue about non-licensed drivers driving another person's, generally a family member's, taxi, and off-meter fares being impossible. I don't have a lot of sympathy for either of those concerns as they tend to eventually rip off me, the consumer of those practices. The fare hike of several years ago was contentious upon the drivers installing the units, and they get more money now (gouging, I swear) but are unwilling to hold up their end of the bargain.
However, I will totally agree about the erratic nature of the displays. The GPS in every cab I have taken with the technology installed shows that the cab isn't even on a street but rather in the middle of some city block. For instance, driving down 3rd ave it looks like I am in the middle of the block between 3rd and Lexington. The LCD screen is really shoddy and pixely, the touch technology feels 5 years old, and I just don't understand why the city of NY or the taxi drivers would want to make the investment if it ALREADY desperately needs to be fixed and improved, months after installation.
In short, not a bad idea and striking about it is ludicrous at best, but certainly not a very good implementation of the concept.
Jesse S @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:18PM
The way it's being implemented is bad. And you can already pay with a CC in nearly all cabs.
All it does is pipe ads and a crappy GPS map, yet it costs the drivers thousands in installs, repairs, etc.
STrRedWolf @ Oct 22nd 2007 12:56PM
Just remember: When trying to travel to Coney Island, do not follow Dora the Explorer's instructions instead of the Taxi. This is what mass transit is for.
newgalactic @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:26PM
...take the subway.
Grant @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:29PM
GPS works poorly at best in NYC, the GPS signals just bounce off of the towers and it's hard to get a half decent signal. Even the best GPS units get confused when you are dealing with multi-level streets.
To make taxi drivers foot the bill for a mandatory poorly functioning system is a bit ridiculous, especially if it's going to be streaming ads, then that should be covering the costs.
Even though it sucks hard to be in NYC when the TWA goes on strike, they at least have a legit reason for this.
Teck90 @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:38PM
NY has a first rate subway system. Take it, its faster (usually) and cheaper. If not, pay an extra 5 bucks and get to ride in a town car.
Phillip Lamb @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:43PM
Yeah, seriously. I can get a car service from BK to TriBeCa and it costs $10. Cab would cost $25. Also, note to anyone visiting the city: DO NOT go with 777-7777. They charge two to three times as much as all other car services in the city.
Jesse S @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:45PM
Car service for $5 extra? What in the hell are you smoking?
Tonbo @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:45PM
This has nothing to do with privacy or the insignificant install fee, and everything to do with the huge amounts Cab drivers stand to loose when years of underreporting to the IRS comes to an end. Credit card fees will also take a slice off the top too.
Jesse S @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:45PM
You're an idiot.
John Doe @ Oct 22nd 2007 2:09PM
And you're a tool. He had a point. My uncle is a cab driver and there IS shit that doesn't get reported.
Lemmiwinks @ Oct 22nd 2007 4:30PM
They. Already. Take. Credit cards.
Now they're being given a new system that's nowhere near as reliable as the established tech they're already using. If this thing goes down, or if it's network goes down, they're unable to meter fares *and* take credit card payments.
KR @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:45PM
I've been working in Manhattan for over a year, and I've not once taken a cab anywhere. I either walk or take the subway. So really, whether these cabbies strike, install GPS, or anything else has no effect on me.
I can see a slight positive if they strike, as then there will be fewer cars on the road...
I know there are many people who benefit daily by taking cabs, so my POV is purely a selfish one.
Cabbies do need to realize that NYC will continue to go about it's business whether they're driving or not. We'll find a way to get where we're going without them.
So, if the majority says they want GPS in the cabs, it seems to me that the smart thing would be to install the unit.
If they strike, they lose income, while we still manage to travel and generally go about our lives.
LC @ Oct 22nd 2007 3:21PM
"Cabbies do need to realize that NYC will continue to go about it's business whether they're driving or not. We'll find a way to get where we're going without them."
Exactly. Mass transit strikes cripple a city because no one can handle the sheer volume, but if cabbies strike, mass transit could easily absorb the commuters.
AcidElement @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:47PM
Take your racist comments and shove them up your fucking ass. Prick.
Glenn @ Oct 22nd 2007 1:49PM
Engadget: I understand you filing this under "Transportation". But filing it under "Gaming"?
Or is finding a taxi in NYC sorta like a game? Sometimes you win? Sometimes you lose? (Or do dispatchers use gaming software as a kind of traffic control "game"? Fun, fun, fun! ...not.)
Sam_Smith @ Oct 22nd 2007 2:02PM
Its completely unfair to the drivers. Period.
This shouldn't be forced, it should be an optional "feature" (if you want to call it that)
As stated many times above, cabs already have credit card readers, so thats not an issue. As for the "GPS", it has no real functionality. The GPS is used to determine position and report that position back to HQ to be logged and stored. Would you be happy if someone knew your every position of the day in your own vehicle? The device doesn't even give directions! What benefit is the GPS to the customer then? The thing pipes ads at the customer, something that would simply piss me off, and the drivers don't see a cent of the cash from those ads either. If a cab has one of these machines, and it goes down, then what? Well, the meter stops working and the driver loses his car while its repaired (at their expense, mind you). A quick swipe of spray paint can cause hundreds of dollars in damage.
Why should they be forced to pay thousands of dollars for a system that benefits neither themselves or the customer? Beats me
Mike @ Oct 22nd 2007 2:07PM
The cabbies are just whining because they won't be able to scam as much. Tough luck. I have no sympathy for them. They are virtually all a-holes anyway. When was the last time you saw one get out and help put your luggage in the trunk? It used to be that someone in business felt like they should be polite to customers. Now they act like they're doing you a favor. Boston is even worse than New York. Screw the lot of them. Maybe some accountability will make them do their job.
James @ Oct 22nd 2007 3:24PM
Maybe if it didn't cost a half million dollars to get a single medallion (!!!), polite cabbies could afford to get into the business again. The problem, as usual, is over-regulation, not under-regulation.
yada @ Oct 22nd 2007 3:14PM
"It is good to see that their are still a few people that will take a stand for THEIR rights! You go Taxi Drivers, because nobody else will do it for you!"
The reason they don't want to accept the GPS units is because it will infringe on their right to rip you off. Get on any NY City cab and the first question they ask you is "how do I get there?" If you don't know the answer to that question, they will take you for a ride. The reason they don't want GPS units is because they make this sort difficult and, in case they pull it of, it can be proven.
Crooks!
Nith @ Oct 22nd 2007 3:22PM
I am from Canada so maybe that is why I am confused, but what does GPS have to do with Credit Card payments or personal cellphones with GPS?!!
Every taxi I have ever been accpeted credit card in some one, even if it is the oldschool slider and call in service.
What I do agree is that sticking a GPS in everycab will only let the taxi companies and the government track every movement of the cabbie. If you ever used a cab you'll know that cabbies don't always report everything but then you get a discount anyway (e.g. charging a flat rate instead of putting the meter on and hence saving you 10 or 20 bucks). Also all the cabs have two ways of charging, per 300-500 meters travelled (depends on the company) and per 30seconds of standing idle.
Lemmiwinks @ Oct 22nd 2007 4:27PM
you are a tool
cristiana @ Oct 22nd 2007 5:02PM
This was said above, but, it bears repeating. The requirement for installing GPS systems came about in 2004 when TLC approved a 26% fare hike. Contingent on this fare hike was that all cabs were to have GPS installed after October 2007.
From USA Today:
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2007-07-25-nyc-gps-cab-strike_N.htm
The commission initially called for the technology while approving a 26% fare increase in 2004. Starting on Oct. 1, as taxis come up for inspection, they will be required to have the technology.
Since they agreed to the fare hike, they all also agreed to the requirement to install GPS systems.
Ross Sheingold @ Oct 22nd 2007 6:02PM
Some NYC Taxi Drivers Go On Strike
http://www.1010wins.com/NYC-Taxi-Group-Says-Strike-Is-On--2nd-in-2-Months/1114795
NEW YORK (1010 WINS) -- For the second time in two months, some New York City cabbies went on strike Monday to protest new rules requiring credit card and GPS technology in taxis, but the walkout appeared to have little impact on transportation.
VIEW: NYC Contingency Plan
It wasn't immediately clear how many drivers were honoring the strike.
Bhairavi Desai, executive director of the Taxi Workers Alliance, said that 75 percent of all cabs were on strike. She said she based her estimate on scouts who report back to the alliance, the group leading the strike.
But at the city's major transportation hubs, yellow cabs were lined up as usual Monday morning, and taxis could be seen along many streets.
1010 WINS AUDIO: Kathleen Maloney Reports
"We are monitoring conditions and at this point have not observed a significant drop in the number of taxis on the road,'' said Andrew Troisi, a spokesman for the city's Office of Emergency Management.
Ned Bolcar, who was getting into one in a long line of cabs outside the Port Authority Bus Terminal, said he didn't even know there was a strike until he read about it Monday morning. He said he wasn't surprised to see so many still on the job.
"The ones who work make money, they have bills to pay,'' he said.
Cabbie Jose Torres, who honored the two-day taxi strike last month, said he was working this time because he was afraid commuters would learn to use other means of transportation.
"If you don't work, there are more problems. Little by little, we lose all our customers. People will learn to take trains,'' Torres said.
Last month, the alliance, which claims to represent about a fifth of the city's 44,000 licensed cab drivers, called the two-day strike a success. But city officials said it had little effect.
The alliance is opposed to the new credit card and GPS technology that is being phased in as yellow cabs come up for inspection, saying it is a costly invasion of cabbies' privacy. It also maintains that the system does not always work.
Under the city's strike contingency plan, taxi drivers choosing to work are required to pick up multiple passengers and charge fares on a zone-based system.
Passengers each pay $10, plus $5 for each new zone they pass through. Manhattan is divided into four zones, and each of the outer boroughs is considered a zone.
Rides between Manhattan and the city's airports also are subject to a flat, per-person fare of $20 for LaGuardia and $30 for Kennedy. If necessary, city officials will also allow livery cabs to pick up passengers trying to wave down a ride.
LS @ Oct 22nd 2007 6:06PM
Forgot about the strike today and took a cab in Midtown. The driver didn't have the meter running, which was strange until the end of the ride when I discovered why - he was using the old zone system. 15 bucks for a trip that usually costs $6. I'm not even sure it was legal.
Thanks to that one guy, I'm now all for the new GPS systems.
PEZ @ Oct 22nd 2007 6:10PM
GOod, go back to your own country and let someone who really needs a job work. YOU THINK YOU OWN THE STREETS? WRONG.
Darkest Daze @ Oct 22nd 2007 8:11PM
Privacy? These people are working..driving someone elses car. They don't have the right to privacy when your time is on someone elses clock. Now you can't take those side fares without acknowledging it didn't happen, oh well. If you don't like it, then find another job, if not, then do your damn job and if your boss wants a GPS in his car, who are you to say he' not allowed to?
exactly @ Oct 22nd 2007 10:09PM
Exactly.
What privacy? What rights?
Their rights to rip off tourists?
jase @ Oct 22nd 2007 11:22PM
honestly the only thing that upsets me about this is that i am studying abroad and I am going to miss the opportunty to drive downtown without the freaking taxi cutting me off or causeing taffic. *%#@ them, they strike because they are being stopped from ripping people off, God bless America where we have the right to scam.