European Commissioner gives Microsoft one week to respond to 360 scratching woes

Although reports of the Xbox 360 scratching discs have been floating around for a while, the story really got legs a couple months ago when a Dutch TV show called Kassa aired a segment claiming to prove that the 360 damages media. Although Microsoft promised to look into the problem, apparently that's not good enough for Meglena Kuneva, the European Commissioner for Consumer Affairs, who has given Redmond exactly one week to detail how it's handled the bad DVD drive situation in the Netherlands, how widespread the problem is in other markets, and how many complaints have been received in those markets. While the Commissioner says the European Commissions doesn't have the "competencies" to force a recall at this time, she does say that she'll be "more than happy to act" if she finds legal grounds to do so. Ouch. Better get it figured out, boys -- the clock's ticking.

Read - Kassa article
Read - Inquirer article
Listen - (Mostly) English interview with Maglena Kuneva [streaming .wma, starts around 2:53]

[Russ @ Jun 1st 2007 10:46PM]

Oh Wow the European Commissioner for Consumer Affairs.....I'm sure MS will get right on that....

any second now...

[Paul @ Jun 1st 2007 10:53PM]

good fix that crap microshit ps3 pwns all

[Josef F @ Jun 2nd 2007 12:07AM]

Yeah! And 17 months from now, when you can actually get good games for the PS3, it will be a hell of s system.

[Alex @ Jun 1st 2007 11:02PM]

Yup....true that.....my 360 scratches my discs, a couple enough so that they occasionally cannot be read, bringing up the little message that basically screws up anything not saved. It should have been fixed a long time ago.

[Drew @ Jun 2nd 2007 12:16PM]

Yeah I know what you are talking about. My best friend has the same problem with his Xbox 360. His discs are so badly scratched that they can't be read. I think Microsoft needs to not just fix the unit but replace the discs as well. I keep telling him to call Microsoft, but he's so busy he can't get around to it. Hopefully Microsoft will realize this problem.

[kingofwale @ Jun 1st 2007 11:17PM]

instead of the disc thing, how about making Microsoft fix the red ring of death? Or at least, make them admit it's NOT only affecting 5% of their products.

[david @ Jun 2nd 2007 12:57PM]

Red ring of death? is that like, "The Ring"? Does a little crazy girl come out of the 360 and kill you using a PS3 8-O

[brutha @ Jun 1st 2007 11:55PM]

Europe should get off MS' back....jealous ppl.

[Paul @ Jun 2nd 2007 4:38AM]

and 2 months from now your 360 will be broken! maybe even less!

[TheGuy @ Jun 2nd 2007 12:09AM]

This should be Microsoft's new slogan in Europe:

"Microsoft

We make a hobby out-of annoying the EU."

[ssuk @ Jun 2nd 2007 8:11AM]

Just to bring some balance:
Sony's EU slogan: "Oh, Europe, didn't see you there. Here, have some over priced shit."
Nintendo's: "We'll give you stuff eventually, if not, we'll rip any good out of games which require stuff we haven't given you and STILL charge over the odds for it.

[V @ Jun 2nd 2007 2:31AM]

European means what? Europe minus germany has a smaller GDP(gross domestic product) than microsoft. microsoft could care less what they have to say, what does europe have, a few vacation spots, ha, funny. redmond is worried very little, european union should be more concerned that microsoft wont allow their product to be sold there anymore

[lolling @ Jun 2nd 2007 2:48AM]

How do you figure that? Microsoft's revenue for 2006 was around $45 billion. That's not even a scratch on, say, the United Kingdom's GDP of over $2 trillion. Or France with $1.8 trillion.

Now, having corrected your idiotic comment, you think it's a case of the EU being worried about Microsoft not allowing their product to be sold there any more? Hahahaha. It's a case of Microsoft worrying about losing out on a huge market, actually.

If you're honestly naive enough to believe that Microsoft won't do what the EU wants, I suggest you go look up these three letters: "XP N".

[Golgo @ Jun 2nd 2007 4:52AM]

V: check your facts before you open your mouth. it's well know Americans have a talent for being ignorant to anything outside the US, and you aren't exactly improving that image

[ReM @ Jun 3rd 2007 7:46AM]

FYI: Europe has more than twice the population of the United States and 25% more GDP. So the US has the larger GDP-per-capita, but Europe outscales it. Please don't be so ignorant about it.

[Unremarkable @ Jun 2nd 2007 11:05PM]

No, no.. Hes reinforcing it nicely.

[V @ Jun 3rd 2007 1:28AM]

come on this is more controversial, where are the replies.
a simple fact the u.s. GDP greater than combined china, japan, germany, france, britain. my point in saying european union matters little to redmond is, purchasing power of the people. dont fret, and remember the u.s. is the master of the planet. our yearly defense spending is great than the 6 greatest powers on the planet COMBINED! to care what europe does or complains about matters little, they dont have world respect, they have little cashflow to purchase anything but failure. redmond cares if india is happy, a wee bit about japan, a little more on chinas concerns.

[Mark @ Jun 3rd 2007 11:22AM]

Dear "V",
Thats not how supply and demand works stupid. You would think in order to use the GDP as an economic argument you would actually need to take some kind of Macroeconomics class and understand the material. If you're in a class, you should bitch slap your teacher for not being worth his salt. Otherwise I guess you're just a Wikipedia scholar.

[V @ Jun 4th 2007 3:29AM]

stupid huh? the combination of keys typed, leaves me to believe, our medical doctors are honest in the desire to heal, not just to get us to keep coming back.
i am correct in my writing. no matter the bashing. europe was once great, in those great days they left many old building, VISIT them! it will help you absorb reality, this is meat and potatoes, europes use boils down to hasbeens

[Jason Lamb @ Jun 2nd 2007 1:18AM]

I work at a Blockbuster in Ontario (Canada) and see this allllll the time.

[Alber1690 @ Jun 2nd 2007 1:57AM]

The EU has been really annoying lately. I think it began when the Queen knighted Bill Gates; ever since, all of Europe has been mad for what one of them did to an American.

[sonicyouth @ Jun 2nd 2007 2:40AM]

As long as there are suckers to buy their products, MS ain't gonna change a thing. They'll still get their ass kicked by Sony and Nintendo once more good games come down the pipeline (and the inevitable price drop. Does anyone actually buy HD-DVD's for their 360? That's a whole different topic!

[Alex` @ Jun 2nd 2007 3:14AM]

It really seems to me like the EU is out to get Microsoft. Sure, manufacturing problems are pretty bad and shouldn't be tolerated, but it seems we never see the same treatment being dished out to any other company. It's always EU vs Microsoft.

[spam me @ Jun 2nd 2007 3:33AM]

I'm a filthy spammer! Spam me back: [e-mail]

[Mike @ Jun 2nd 2007 4:13AM]

Its not always EU vs. Microsoft. The EU also pressured Apple and investigated Blueray and HD-DVD schemes. I'm sure that many other investigations are going on, they just never make it to Engadget.

I for one am glad that somebody stands up for consumer rights instead of bending over for the big corporations.

[Mark Bowness @ Jun 2nd 2007 4:56AM]

Europe have a flippin' good point and it's good to see them pushing MS as far as they can but, will MS listen, inevitably not!

[Josef F @ Jun 2nd 2007 10:24AM]

True. My Xbox *might* be broken in a couple of months. Also, I *might* get hit by a chunk of meteorite or shot by acid-tripping civil war buffs at some point in the future.

But it's a fact that *right now*, there's nothing for the PS3. Knowing that fact, any gamer who buys that one is a sucker.


(Off to play Shadowrun. One a dozen breakout hits for the XBox. Enjoy your....ummm.....well......I guess enjoy your very heavy, very expensive BluRay player.)

[V @ Jun 2nd 2007 5:59PM]

what kind of response is this? where is the content? you just copy and paste every thread with this non-basis comment?

[Ihar `Philips` Filipau @ Jun 2nd 2007 7:05AM]

"Ouch. Better get it figured out, boys -- the clock's ticking."

What heck makes a lot of sense - since they prohibit making backup copies of the disks.

Heck, instead of using DRM for something people can really utilize... I mean they haven't even tried to make DRM to allow backup copies, thus helping people. Only DRM - to restrict people. No more comments.

[Brendan @ Jun 2nd 2007 9:39AM]

IT does damage the discs, when you move it. It just ruined my guitar hero, thank god for disc doctor.

[Realize @ Jun 2nd 2007 10:58AM]

@Josef F
"No offence fella please don't exaggerrate!".
"So far Shadowrun ratings are fair. I won't call it AAA. Gamespot gave it a 7 graphics wise.
http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages4/929196.asp

[D @ Jun 2nd 2007 12:30PM]

Golgo: Check your facts, who said V was American?, the hypocracy in calling someone else ignorant.

[James @ Jun 2nd 2007 11:03AM]

why do xbox fans get so definsive when sony is mentioned,is it because once more ps3 games hit there system won't be talked about anymore or is it because to play their regular xbox games they have to pay microsoft a fee,you to know a ps3 will play 1000's of games, it's backwards compatitble?sorry!

[Josef F @ Jun 2nd 2007 11:36AM]

Realize: "No offence fella please don't exaggerrate! So far Shadowrun ratings are fair. I won't call it AAA. Gamespot gave it a 7 graphics wise."


Uhh, have you played the game? Don't judge things on reviewers. In general, they don't know what the fuck their talking about.

[Realize @ Jun 2nd 2007 12:04PM]

Have I played the game ? Sure I have.I played the beta.I had fun with it for few minutes, I have more fun with crackdown ,Halo 3 beta, resistance fall of men ,Warhawk online Gear of war Rainbow 2 Graw2. Shadowrun is what it is ,some people will like it some won't. but the point is it's not AAA material. period! P.s I have both consoles. My problem with ps3 it needs more quality games. My problem with xbox360 is it's not reliable hardware. "I know for a fact . My warranty is good through 2009. I'm on my 7th xbox360.

[Josef F @ Jun 2nd 2007 11:38AM]

Which is to say "they don't know what THEY'RE talking about"



(I hate when people screw that up. Most of all, I hate it when *I* screw it up.)

[hnkelley @ Jun 2nd 2007 1:01PM]

They better get on this and soon! My MOTHER's favorite game is getting more scratched each time she plays it!!! (Ya, good ol' mom, 64 and counting, plays more than I do.)

[Alex` @ Jun 2nd 2007 12:01PM]

you emphatically DO NOT have to pay microsoft a fee to play old xbox games on your 360, don't talk rubbish, James. The 360 is a great platform, and the PS3 is a good piece of hardware, but to buy the PS3 at the moment, when there are no really good games for it, and at a price of £425 (That's $850!) it's completely and utterly not worth it. This time next year, maybe, but not at the moment.

[Golgo @ Jun 2nd 2007 6:13PM]

Content? Non-basis? Excuse me, but your comment is the one completely lacking basis and content. You cant seriously expect such an ignorant comment to pass without getting battered. If you want content, see lolling's reply.

[Jayceon Carter @ Jun 2nd 2007 6:32PM]

I've noticed the "Kassa" article is translated horrible by babelfish. For anyone that might be interested, here's a better translation (as far as my English goes as a Dutch native).

A fact to understand the numbers more easily: "Kassa" has an estimated viewing audience of 1.5 million every show (once a week that is). That's about 10% of the population in The Netherlands.

---
EC asks Microsoft to clarify Xbox [360] problems

The European Commission (EC) will tackle the problem with Microsofts game console Xbox. As told by Meglena Kuneva, European commissioner for consumer matter, last friday in an interview on "VARA"'s radio programme "Radio Kassa". Kuneva has sent a letter to Microsoft, in which she asks them for clarification concerning the recent problems with the device.

The TV programme "Kassa" revealed some weeks ago that the Xbox scratches the games cds. More than thousand customers notified "Kassa" about the problem, but the problem seems to be concerning Xbox [360]'s worldwide. It concerns a batch of probably 2 million Xbox consoles which have been equipped with a bad dvd-drive, all of them produced in 2006. Microsoft denied the problem at first, but at the end of april they came to a settlement with Dutch customers. As of today, the company still refuses a worldwide recall.

Because the Xbox problems are not limited to The Netherlands, Kuneva has now asked Microsoft for a clarification. She's given the company a week to reply on the matter how to solve the problem for other European countries, and pushes Xbox users from all over Europe to file a complaint together.

Kuneva said in "Radio Kassa" she expects Microsoft to pick up and handle with the problem rapidly and in a good way. In "Radio Kassa", she spoke of "a strong matter" about which she has addressed Microsoft firmly.

Listen to the fragment from "Radio Kassa" of 1-6-2007 [link]

On the website of European commissioner Meglena Kuneva the next statement is to be found:

[statement already in English]
---

Dutch review website Hardware.Info (also available in English), revealed a detailed report about the scratching Xbox consoles:
http://www.hardware.info/en-UK/articles/amdnY2pxZGOa/Scratching_Xbox_360/

News articles from the same website:
April 15th: http://www.hardware.info/en-UK/news/ym%2BclJqawpya/Microsoft_admits_Xbox_360_problems/
April 25th: http://www.hardware.info/en-UK/news/ym%2BclZqZwpaa/Microsoft_admits_xbox360_may_cause_scratches/

There are also video links to Youtube in the news articles where you can see the TV Programma with English subtitling.

[Ciro @ Jun 2nd 2007 10:59PM]

Oh Wow the European Commissioner for Consumer Affairs.....I'm sure MS will get right on that....

any second now...


LOL IDIOT UNLESS THEY WANT ANOTHER 300 MILLION FINE I GUESS THEY LL REALLY FIX IT THIS TIME.

XBOTS

[JBDragon @ Jun 3rd 2007 5:40PM]

I have had my 360 since Dec 26th 2005. Not a single problem with it. Not a Single Scratch on any disc.

[Chris @ Jun 4th 2007 5:45AM]

This problem is totally misrepresented. I've had an Xbox360 for 6 months now and have seen scratched disks but all have been totally by fault of the user. The disks typically get scratched when someone is messing with the console why the disk is spinning inside it or by storing a disk inside and transporting the console from place to place. I have yet to experience this problem because I use simple common sense.

[Ashton @ Jun 20th 2007 6:53AM]

My 360 didn't scratch my discs until I downloaded the Halo 3 Beta and five days later I got the three lights. Now I have $130 to pay for repairs. BTW the towel trick worked once but three days later problems emerged again.

[Wekko @ Jun 3rd 2007 5:19AM]

"a simple fact the u.s. GDP greater than combined china, japan, germany, france, britain"

The GDP of the European Union (which is not all of Europe) alone is greater than US GDP:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union
Yes, I trust Wikipedia more than your biased opinion on this.

"our yearly defense spending is great than the 6 greatest powers on the planet COMBINED!"

Guess what, we have proper health care for every one.

Anyways, Microsoft can't neglect the European Market, they won't. Though I think this 'problem' is a bit overrated since it came out 2 years after launch of the console and only in a Dutch television show. Lot of the problems are probably caused by small children moving the console or scratching the disks themselves.

Of course there is a possibility that some consoles do cause the scratches and Microsoft did not really respond properly to the 'Kassa' television show.

[Jayceon Carter @ Jun 3rd 2007 8:34AM]

@ Wekko:

As been confirmed by Hardware.Info Magazine who tested it during various conditions, the console with TSST drive scratches even when it is laying flat on a stable surface (or standing up). They've tested it with new discs and without moving the console while a disc was inserted.

Any other brand of optical drive used in the Xbox 360 have no problems with scratching or whatsoever. Even when tilted or mildly shaken. Of course, tilting or shaking isn't the way one should handle a console, but it sure gives a hell of a good comparison to the faulty TSST drives. It's like: "look, the TSST drive scratches when laying flat and all other drives can even handle tilting and a little shaking and still won't scratch."

That's what this whole problem's about. Not the scratching alone, but the fact only one company's drive produces it. With that said, Microsoft has already confirmed the problem and is taking action for the European Union (EU). It's still unkown what Microsoft will do for the US. I think it will most likely depent on the amount of 360 owners in the US with this problem. According to the Dutch numer of faulty drives/consoles (over a thousand), the US number of faulty drives/consoles could potentialy be tens of thousands. If this is a correct number, then Microsoft will take action I believe. With that amount they can't just ignore the problem and their customers.

[A Content European @ Jun 3rd 2007 1:35PM]

>>come on this is more controversial, where are the replies.
a simple fact the u.s. GDP greater than combined china, japan, germany, france, britain.

That is just simply untrue, go check your facts

my point in saying european union matters little to redmond is, purchasing power of the people.

err yes it does matter since they get very little revenue from asia or africa with all the piracy compared to europe

dont fret, and remember the u.s. is the master of the planet.

No its not, the US has never been the master of the planet and never will be especially when there are 5.3 billion people who dont live in that crap hole

our yearly defense spending is great than the 6 greatest powers on the planet COMBINED!

You mean wasting? Last time i checked there arent any wars going on of any real size. I for one also think that healthcare for the country is a tad more important and so is welfare, the UK is a prime example of this.

to care what europe does or complains about matters little, they dont have world respect,

Yes they do have respect, the US is the one with very little real respect as it foces most countries to do what it wants via trade sanctions and to be frank i dont think it makes them too happy

they have little cashflow to purchase anything but failure.

Do you honestly believe that?

redmond cares if india is happy, a wee bit about japan, a little more on chinas concerns.

Uhhh those countries especially china, rely on pirated software so in reality redmond doesnt care about them at all apart from trying to get revenue from them which is very unlikely when looking at the average wages of the population.

[Wekko @ Jun 3rd 2007 12:46PM]

"FYI: Europe has more than twice the population of the United States and 25% more GDP. So the US has the larger GDP-per-capita, but Europe outscales it. Please don't be so ignorant about it."

'V' compared absolute GDP, not GDP-per-capita. I know the US has a higher GDP-per-capita.

"As been confirmed by Hardware.Info Magazine who tested it during various conditions, the console with TSST drive scratches even when it is laying flat on a stable surface (or standing up). They've tested it with new discs and without moving the console while a disc was inserted."

A ok, I missed that, my bad.

[Marc @ Jun 3rd 2007 1:19PM]

If whe are gonna talk about total GPD thn the EU>USA
if we are gonna talk about GPD per capita, then luxembourg owns us all.
Doe microsoft care about luxembourg ? ofcourse not, not enough people to sell to. Does microsoft care about the EU, yes because theres alot of people to sell to. Simple as that. By the way, to say Europeans are poor is BS because we just so happen to be the second richest continent on earth, and, none of you "Americans" are probably real americans, just because you pretend not to be european doesnt mean you're not.
Also, in the USA theres a wider gap between the rich and the poor.

[shase @ Jun 4th 2007 11:31AM]

Why are people complaining about something good thats happening? I mean do people like sending back their 360s for repairs or rebuying scratched discs? Sure it could be misuse but probably not everyone who have the problems are misusing the system. I think this is a good wakeup call for MS to fix the 360. Not sure what EU can do if MS doesn't comply but they get what they deserve.